Justintime
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if you were indeed god, i'd believe you, but i know who he is
Gay prom date banned
- Thread starter Leslie
- Start date
if you were indeed god, i'd believe you, but i know who he is
outside looking in
<b>Registered Member</b>
Justintime
Guest
GOD ALMIGHTY
YHWH
Originally posted by sbcanada
Homosexuals will burn in the eternal fire of hell. God says so
What I said was it's an abomination. Let Me decide who is unfit for eternal salvation if you please.
Gato_Solo
Out-freaking-standing OTC member
Nope. That means stoning. The Old Testament way of punishment for deadly sin.
As for what verses to keep, and which to throw away, nobody advocated the priests not bringing cattle to the altar for sacrifice (which is what that actually boils down to). Of course, they must be put to death afterward to protect them from further sin...
As for what verses to keep, and which to throw away, nobody advocated the priests not bringing cattle to the altar for sacrifice (which is what that actually boils down to). Of course, they must be put to death afterward to protect them from further sin...
![[b]](/data/avatars/m/0/144.jpg?1334500048){kind=avatar}
[b]
New Member
good for him.
as for this:
You're right, the kid does not have the right to disrupt society by bringing his boyfriend to the prom.
The problem is, it shouldn't of been a disruption for him to do so in the first place. If it were already socially acceptable to be gay he could of waltzed in there and nobody would of cared.
However, what he's fighting for (and won) is the ability for the next gay student to take his/her boy/girlfriend to prom and it not be a disruption.
Again, good for him!
as for this:
You're right, the kid does not have the right to disrupt society by bringing his boyfriend to the prom.
The problem is, it shouldn't of been a disruption for him to do so in the first place. If it were already socially acceptable to be gay he could of waltzed in there and nobody would of cared.
However, what he's fighting for (and won) is the ability for the next gay student to take his/her boy/girlfriend to prom and it not be a disruption.
Again, good for him!
Gato_Solo
Out-freaking-standing OTC member
He won his case, and he brings his date to the prom...big, fat, hairy deal. That wasn't the issue I was getting at. I said that at the beginning. He sued, not because he was forbidden to bring his date to the prom, nor for the rights of future gays to go to THEIR proms. He sued to get attention and to shove his sexuality in peoples faces. There are many times I could have used my race for the same kind of confrontational exhibit, but I refrained. Why, you may ask? Because it would only serve to alienate me, and my cause from the public eye. He had a chance to show everyone at the prom that he, and his date, were actually nice people, but, instead, he chose to start a ruckus. Think that one over...
[b]
New Member
I'm sorry, but how do you know that? Wait a minute...you don't.
So if they are banned from going to the prom, how are they going to prove that they are nice people? It would seem that no matter what they did you would call it a ruckus.
And as far as this goes:
If someone really had wronged you because of your race, you're not doing your cause any good by sitting back and doing nothing. Especially if the reason is to keep from being alienated. That's like saying it's ok for people to walk all over you just because you don't want them not to like you.
The kid's got balls for standing up to the system, getting his issue out front and winning his case. Don't hate him because he did something you could never do.
Now, you think that one over.
Gato_Solo
Out-freaking-standing OTC member
Not to argue with you too much on issues that you obviously know nothing about, but, to put it succinctly, when dealing with racism or sexism, the only thing you get when you act like the young man in question is noteriety, whether you win, as was his case, or not. You may see what he did as a great victory for his civil rights, but I see it as him making a martyr of himself. As for me not behaving in a confrontational manner during my prom, I have this to say...
My cause was actually helped much more by diplomacy than you, and your intellect, can ever know. The tow, or three, people who caused the problem were taken care of...believe me, and the rest of us had a great time at the prom. What has to be learned is that the ones who have a problem with the group, rarely have the problem with the individual. Put any ethnic or gender-based, or religious problem on a level where the two opposite sides have to be alone with it, and there are only two outcomes. Peace, and death. Nobody likes death, so you are forced to deal with your internal problems, thus, you stop seeing a group and start seeing individuals. Maybe this is all too complex for you, but, when you stop with your cranial-rectal inversion, you'll see the big picture.
My cause was actually helped much more by diplomacy than you, and your intellect, can ever know. The tow, or three, people who caused the problem were taken care of...believe me, and the rest of us had a great time at the prom. What has to be learned is that the ones who have a problem with the group, rarely have the problem with the individual. Put any ethnic or gender-based, or religious problem on a level where the two opposite sides have to be alone with it, and there are only two outcomes. Peace, and death. Nobody likes death, so you are forced to deal with your internal problems, thus, you stop seeing a group and start seeing individuals. Maybe this is all too complex for you, but, when you stop with your cranial-rectal inversion, you'll see the big picture.
GOD ALMIGHTY
YHWH
There are a few Palestinians & a some Babylonians I could introduce you to.
[b]
New Member
No, lets argue.
First, as a gay man I happen to have plenty of knowledge on this particular issue. More so then I think you would.
Try being a part of the one group almost everybody hates. I can think of no other group that has less rights then homosexuals.
For example:
We can't get married.
If you're religious it's hard to find a church that will accept you. (Isn't that why the kid had to go to court in the first place?)
It's hard to find jobs that offer "Domestic Partner" benefits.
We have to use the term "Domestic Partner"
In Florida, where I live, we can't adopt and I, for one, would like to.
Holding hands or showing affection in public is likely to get you beat up.
My personal favorite is trying to get people to understand that we don't go around molesting children or trying to recruit people to be gay.
Several months ago, at my old job in a local mall, my boyfriend came to visit me. When he walked in I greeted him by saying, "Hello baby." and kissed him on the cheek. When I did that the woman beside me grabbed her daughter, pulled her towards her, then leaned across the counter to make a derogatory comment to my boss. Ironically, my boss is gay as well and happened to be partly responsible for me and my boyfriend being together.
Try having friends, or better yet parents who disown you because you choose to find love and companionship with someone of the same gender. I've had both. All of my friends from high school quit talking to me after I came out. It was 3 years before my dad would even talk to me, and if I hadn't of accidentally run into him at a restaurant a couple of months ago he'd never of met my boyfriend.
So you see, I have some knowledge of the issue.
I do see what Marc Hall did as a victory for his civil rights as well as mine, but nothing so grand as to make a martyr of himself. But even if he did, martyr's cause changes. Jesus let himself be crucified for what he believed in and people have lived for Jesus' cause for the last 2000 years.
As for my intellectual capacity, well, it seems kinda sad that you resorted to such cheap shots in an effort to get your point across, but allow me the opportunity to enlighten you. My IQ is 140. In 6th grade I had the reading comprehension of a Sophomore college student. I took advanced honors classes all through high school. I participated in several intellectual debates as well as many intellectual competitions. I'm sure I'm qualified to handle a conversation with you.
So, lets talk about this part of your last post...
Which is it for you? You seem to have a problem with the individual, do you have a problem with homosexuals as a group as well? I understand that many people have problems with a group of one type of person. This is due to stereotyping, something I'm sure you're familiar with. I also understand that those same people are able to overcome those problems on a person to person basis.
That is what needs to be overcome. People should accept the group as a whole and take up their problems with the individuals that cause them. I shouldn't have to prove to someone I'm worthy of their friendship. It should be safe to assume that everyone you meet is nice until they prove otherwise.
It is not I who has the problem seeing the big picture, it is anyone who would rather hate a group of people because of a stereotype. It is not I who has the problem seeing the big picture, it is anyone who has to be forced into some "trapped in small spaces" situation in order to overcome their differences with another group of people.
The big picture is to realize that we all start from the same basic group. We all are human. We are all entitled to the same rights as everybody else.
It's easy to forget about the forest if all you see is the tree in front of you.
One last thing, since you seem to think that the way you handled your situation was the correct way to do so, why don't you enlighten us with your wisdom so we can all see the error of our ways.
I'm looking forward to it...
First, as a gay man I happen to have plenty of knowledge on this particular issue. More so then I think you would.
Try being a part of the one group almost everybody hates. I can think of no other group that has less rights then homosexuals.
For example:
We can't get married.
If you're religious it's hard to find a church that will accept you. (Isn't that why the kid had to go to court in the first place?)
It's hard to find jobs that offer "Domestic Partner" benefits.
We have to use the term "Domestic Partner"
In Florida, where I live, we can't adopt and I, for one, would like to.
Holding hands or showing affection in public is likely to get you beat up.
My personal favorite is trying to get people to understand that we don't go around molesting children or trying to recruit people to be gay.
Several months ago, at my old job in a local mall, my boyfriend came to visit me. When he walked in I greeted him by saying, "Hello baby." and kissed him on the cheek. When I did that the woman beside me grabbed her daughter, pulled her towards her, then leaned across the counter to make a derogatory comment to my boss. Ironically, my boss is gay as well and happened to be partly responsible for me and my boyfriend being together.
Try having friends, or better yet parents who disown you because you choose to find love and companionship with someone of the same gender. I've had both. All of my friends from high school quit talking to me after I came out. It was 3 years before my dad would even talk to me, and if I hadn't of accidentally run into him at a restaurant a couple of months ago he'd never of met my boyfriend.
So you see, I have some knowledge of the issue.
I do see what Marc Hall did as a victory for his civil rights as well as mine, but nothing so grand as to make a martyr of himself. But even if he did, martyr's cause changes. Jesus let himself be crucified for what he believed in and people have lived for Jesus' cause for the last 2000 years.
As for my intellectual capacity, well, it seems kinda sad that you resorted to such cheap shots in an effort to get your point across, but allow me the opportunity to enlighten you. My IQ is 140. In 6th grade I had the reading comprehension of a Sophomore college student. I took advanced honors classes all through high school. I participated in several intellectual debates as well as many intellectual competitions. I'm sure I'm qualified to handle a conversation with you.
So, lets talk about this part of your last post...
Which is it for you? You seem to have a problem with the individual, do you have a problem with homosexuals as a group as well? I understand that many people have problems with a group of one type of person. This is due to stereotyping, something I'm sure you're familiar with. I also understand that those same people are able to overcome those problems on a person to person basis.
That is what needs to be overcome. People should accept the group as a whole and take up their problems with the individuals that cause them. I shouldn't have to prove to someone I'm worthy of their friendship. It should be safe to assume that everyone you meet is nice until they prove otherwise.
It is not I who has the problem seeing the big picture, it is anyone who would rather hate a group of people because of a stereotype. It is not I who has the problem seeing the big picture, it is anyone who has to be forced into some "trapped in small spaces" situation in order to overcome their differences with another group of people.
The big picture is to realize that we all start from the same basic group. We all are human. We are all entitled to the same rights as everybody else.
It's easy to forget about the forest if all you see is the tree in front of you.
One last thing, since you seem to think that the way you handled your situation was the correct way to do so, why don't you enlighten us with your wisdom so we can all see the error of our ways.
I'm looking forward to it...
Before I read the rest of the post let me start here.
Can't marry-sux. It should be a civil ceremony though. Since, according to the bible, homosexuality is an abberation. that takes care of 1 & 2.
Domestic Partner benefits-I don't want to break the news to you but hetero couples can't get them either. Untill #1 changes, this shouldn't either.
You shouldn't be able to adopt a newborn. An older, hard to place child on the other hand, is silly.
Showing affection in public: a kiss on the cheek is no big deal. A long drawn out tonsil touching probe is outlandish, same with hetero couples. Nobody wants to see that
lastly-some people have a preconceived notion about homosexuality. Sorry, can't change stupidity. However, the fems amongst you certainly don't help. I have a couple of gay friends who are gay in the bedroom & just guys everywhere else. Then the fags come out & prance & queen their way into an ass kicking & whine it's not fair. Who cares what your sex life is...but act like a man.
now, back to reading the rest of the post.
[b]
New Member
Response in line with text:
Personally, I don't care about having a wedding ceremony. I feel that if there is truly a bond of love between two people, all it should take is the asking. If the other person says yes, then you're married. Forget about all the rest and be happy together. But there are those who would like a ceremony, who am I to say they can't?
It's still too bad about #2. I don't prescribe to any written religious philosophy. I do my own thing when it comes what I believe. But for those who do follow, it must be hard to believe in something and be cast out. I just can't see how any loving/merciful god would be choosy about his followers.
This I don't understand. The only argument I could come up with that would agree with your statement would be two men are incapable of breastfeeding a newborn baby. True. However, I would point out that many couples that adopt do so because they are unable to have children on their own. This being the case, the chances of the mother being able to breastfeed are just slightly better then mine.
Agreed.
I used to feel the same way. I was gay in the bedroom, straight to the world. And for the most part I still am. I also had a real problem with the fems and queens. I thought that it was way too overboard. Until I worked with one. He was one of the nicest guys that worked there. Would help anybody. We we're really good friends. I realized that he was true to himself, and he didn't care what people thought.
After that I started hanging out with more of the guys I had avoided before. I've met some really nice people. It takes a lot of strength to be yourself. These guys have some of the biggest balls I know.
Personally, I don't care about having a wedding ceremony. I feel that if there is truly a bond of love between two people, all it should take is the asking. If the other person says yes, then you're married. Forget about all the rest and be happy together. But there are those who would like a ceremony, who am I to say they can't?
It's still too bad about #2. I don't prescribe to any written religious philosophy. I do my own thing when it comes what I believe. But for those who do follow, it must be hard to believe in something and be cast out. I just can't see how any loving/merciful god would be choosy about his followers.
This I don't understand. The only argument I could come up with that would agree with your statement would be two men are incapable of breastfeeding a newborn baby. True. However, I would point out that many couples that adopt do so because they are unable to have children on their own. This being the case, the chances of the mother being able to breastfeed are just slightly better then mine.
Agreed.
I used to feel the same way. I was gay in the bedroom, straight to the world. And for the most part I still am. I also had a real problem with the fems and queens. I thought that it was way too overboard. Until I worked with one. He was one of the nicest guys that worked there. Would help anybody. We we're really good friends. I realized that he was true to himself, and he didn't care what people thought.
After that I started hanging out with more of the guys I had avoided before. I've met some really nice people. It takes a lot of strength to be yourself. These guys have some of the biggest balls I know.
Gato_Solo
Out-freaking-standing OTC member
First...what cheap shot? You said you have an IQ of 140, so show me my cheap shot...
Second...My way of dealing with the problem was to show up and have a good time.
Third...I never said he didn't have the right to show up at his prom with his date...
As for the enlightenment, and the obvious cheap shot you gave me by insinuating I was stupid, I'll give you some enlightenment...
You stated that you were gay...Who cares? I surely don't. It's your life, and live it the way you wish as long as you don't try to force it upon me. You also stated that you are part of a group that "Almost everybody hates". THAT was my point. If you use your superior intellect, you'll see that most demands for equality by an individual may have some effect on that individual, but are not always carried over to the majority. He won his court case, but has now made himself (the individual) an object of scorn. He also made himself out to be a victim. Instead of showing up at the prom, with his date and 20 or so more people, straight and homosexual, to picket and show him some support, he went at it alone. If he ends up getting a 'beat-down' or worse, how would you feel then?
[b]
New Member
OK.
Not only do you insinuate that I lack intelligence you also call me a butthead. Boo on you.
THATS IT?!? Then what does this mean?
Sounds to me like something more happened. I was just curious as to what? Something had to of happened if they were taken care of like you stated . And besides, I don't see where your situation draws a parallel to his. Were either you or your date banned from the prom?
I do. But that's not the point. The only reason I mentioned I was gay was in response to this statement made by you:
I only mentioned it to show you that this was indeed an issue I had some familiarity with.
It doesn't take superior intellect to know that. But the point of what Marc Hall did was to set a precedent, and when enough precedents are set it will follow over to the majority. Now that Marc Hall has done what he has, hopefully other gay students will start coming forward to demand their right to take their same sex date to prom. Once they've done that, they'll start demanding other rights, and pretty soon gay people won't be afraid anymore. Those that are afraid will see that there are enough of us out there not to be afraid. This is just like any other civil liberty movement. It all starts with one person.
If you read the post over he's only made himself an object of scorn to you. The other person who had negative comments were about homosexuality in general. Everybody else seems to have neutral to positive feelings about the situation.
And THAT wouldn't of caused a ruckus?!?! Let's see, by your logic:
1 boy goes to court + media gets wind = ruckus.
or
1 boy + 19 supporters picketing a high school prom + lots of media coverage (I added this part, you know they wouldn't pass up on 20 people picketing a catholic high school prom over issues of homosexuality ) = everybody's happy?
I just don't understand how anyone could think that 20 protesters marching outside a Catholic School prom would be better then one kid going to court.
The only way this wouldn't of made headlines is if he just sat back and didn't say anything to anybody. And that is unacceptable.
I'd feel the same way I do any time I read where someone is beat up or killed over an issue of race, gender, religion or sexuality...it would sadden me greatly. It would be the same way I felt for you when I read your post Women aren't always the victims . It's unfortunate that something like that has to happen to anybody, for whatever reason.