View Full Version : CA Marijuana Legalization on the ballot!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/stephen-gutwillig/ca-marijuana-legalization_b_511484.html
CA Marijuana Legalization Initiative to Qualify for Ballot Today
by
Stephen Gutwillig
Today, an initiative that would legalize personal marijuana possession and allow regulated sales of marijuana to adults will qualify for California's November general election ballot. A win at the ballot would be a first of its kind in U.S. history. This is a remarkable moment in the struggle to change our decades-old marijuana policies.
Marijuana was prohibited in 1937 before most Americans had ever heard of it. Today the U.S. leads the world in marijuana consumption. Nearly 26 million Americans used marijuana last year and more than 100 million have tried it in their lifetimes. A huge commodity of the underground economy, marijuana is the nation's top cash crop, valued at $14 billion in California alone. Our state Board of Equalization has estimated we would generate $1.4 billion a year by taxing marijuana like alcohol.
Like it or not, marijuana has become a mainstream recreational drug. It is second only to alcohol and cigarettes in popularity and is objectively far less harmful than either. Marijuana is drastically less addictive and cannot cause an overdose. Every major independent study has debunked the gateway myth; for the profound majority of users, marijuana is the only drug people sample not the first. Children across the country consistently report that marijuana is easy for them to get from their peers and the black market while significant barriers exist to buying alcohol and cigarettes.
Unthinkable carnage in Mexico has claimed 15,000 lives since the Calderon government declared war on drug cartels three years ago. Our government estimates the cartels generate at least 60% of their profits from marijuana alone. Following the murders of several U.S. consular workers, Secretary of State Clinton returned to Mexico this week, acknowledging that demand in the U.S. dominates these markets. But she didn't acknowledge that rampant violence is not a byproduct of the cannabis plant itself but of the prohibition that creates a profit motive people are willing to kill for.
Americans are increasingly turning against the prohibition that fails to protect our kids and guarantees a monopoly of profits to violent criminal syndicates on both sides of the border. While polls have long confirmed that large majorities favor treating marijuana possession as an infraction without arrest let alone jail, support for ending marijuana prohibition outright is quickly gaining speed. A Gallup poll last year reported that a historic 44 percent of Americans favor legalization, a 10-point jump since 2001. Meanwhile, sizable majorities of Californians are ahead of that curve, giving rise to the historic initiative we'll vote on this fall.
With this cultural transition underway, you might think enforcement of our marijuana laws would reflect their unpopularity. Sadly, quite the opposite is the case. Arrests for marijuana offenses have actually tripled nationwide since 1991. In California, which decriminalized low-level possession in 1975, arrests have jumped 127 percent in the same two decades the arrest rate for crime in general fell by 40 percent. Police made nearly 850,000 marijuana arrests across the country last year, half of all drug arrests and more than all violent crime arrests combined. No law in the United States is enforced so widely yet deemed so unnecessary.
Worse still, marijuana laws are enforced selectively with racist results. In California, African Americans are three times more likely than whites to be arrested for a marijuana offense despite comparable or even lower rates of consumption. An expose by the Pasadena Weekly found that blacks, who represent 14 percent of that city's population, accounted for more than half all marijuana arrests in the last five years.
It's hard to overstate the significance of the vote this November. Banning marijuana outright has been a disaster, fueling a massive, increasingly brutal, underground economy, wasting billions in scarce law enforcement resources, and making criminals of countless law-abiding citizens. Elected officials haven't stopped these punitive, profligate policies. Now voters can bring the reality check of sensible marijuana regulation to California.
I think Cheech, and Tommy will get it through this time.
I wonder, does Willie Nelson live in Ca.???
I think Cheech, and Tommy will get it through this time.
I wonder, does Willie Nelson live in Ca.???
No. Too many taxes. :lol:
He lives in Texas.
ResearchMonkey
3/26/10, 05:57pm
Three days to clear your blood, I bet DUI's go up. Corporate insurance will still require drug test for machine operators and drivers. I wonder how expensive it will be to Nat'l health care since pot can being on otherwise manageable mental illenss's. I wonder if Nat'l health care will eliminate all smoking eventually?
Three days to clear your blood, I bet DUI's go up. Corporate insurance will still require drug test for machine operators and drivers. I wonder how expensive it will be to Nat'l health care since pot can being on otherwise manageable mental illenss's. I wonder if Nat'l health care will eliminate all smoking eventually?
Would you mind rewriting that in English, please? (Not trying to insult but I can't understand what you wrote.)
:confused:
Three days to clear your blood, I bet DUI's go up. Corporate insurance will still require drug test for machine operators and drivers. I wonder how expensive it will be to Nat'l health care since pot can being on otherwise manageable mental illenss's. I wonder if Nat'l health care will eliminate all smoking eventually?
They can test 'levels', similar to alcohol, but it'd be harder to spot to start with probably.
I suspect they'll have 'road test' blood meters soon anyway like those diabetes testers.
ResearchMonkey
3/26/10, 07:38pm
Would you mind rewriting that in English, please? (Not trying to insult but I can't understand what you wrote.)
:confused:being >> > bring
It is ironic.
Damn near every lefty beauracrat has gone out of their way to end the evils of tobacco while working diligently to make marijuana smoking legal.
being >> > bring
Ah, ok...
my response would be: so can alcohol.
It is ironic.
Damn near every lefty beauracrat has gone out of their way to end the evils of tobacco while working diligently to make marijuana smoking legal.
We have smokers at my work. There's been a push by certain Right-Wing Holy-Roller office ladies, who I shall not name (:rolleyes: ), to make it so the smokers can't smoke outside the building. They claim it gives the wrong impression of our company, even though the smokers smoke about 20 feet away from the back door. I support their right to smoke. Tobacco is not illegal and these biddies need to mind their own business.
Anyway, back to marijuana. You don't have to smoke marijuana to get a high. There are other ways of taking it. But aside from that...
"The largest study of its kind has unexpectedly concluded that smoking marijuana, even regularly and heavily, does not lead to lung cancer." (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/05/25/AR2006052501729.html)
Anyway, back to marijuana. You don't have to smoke marijuana to get a high. There are other ways of taking it.
yeah, I knew 2 people (so far) personally, that died from huffing ...
one from glue, and one from gasoline.
Sad. It's a bad way to go too.
Tobacco is not illegal and these biddies need to mind their own business.
Yep.
something we can all agree on. got a light?
yeah, I knew 2 people (so far) personally, that died from huffing ...
one from glue, and one from gasoline.
Sad. It's a bad way to go too.
Gasoline? Jeeze! I thought glue was bad enough!
Yep.
something we can all agree on. got a light?
:headbng2:
:evilsmok:
*pimp*
:smoke:
I'm not a smoker but yes I'll pass the lighter.
:bong:
ResearchMonkey
3/27/10, 07:03pm
Ah, ok...
my response would be: so can alcohol.
And I'm sure you believe your response makes perfect sense.
Alcohol is processed at a rate ~3hrs for 1oz ~pure alcohol. Pot metabolizes minimum of ~3days; which means you cannot drive for 3days after getting high if your an occasional doper. Lot's of people will be unhirable and many will be at work while still under the influence.
You might think thats fine if you're the doper but the people paying the bills don't.
Legalization Of Marijuana On The Ballot In California In November! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4j2uLOcHJo)
I'm moving to cali
Boo Ya
And I'm sure you believe your response makes perfect sense.
Alcohol is processed at a rate ~3hrs for 1oz ~pure alcohol. Pot metabolizes minimum of ~3days; which means you cannot drive for 3days after getting high if your an occasional doper. Lot's of people will be unhirable and many will be at work while still under the influence.
You might think thats fine if you're the doper but the people paying the bills don't.
If you're getting 3-days of buzz from one hit, it makes me wonder where you're getting your stuff.
If you're getting 3-days of buzz from one hit, it makes me wonder where you're getting your stuff.
I actually made the mistake of eating an entire "space cake" in Utrecht once. I was still high the next day, but not for 3 days. To his credit, the guy behind the counter told us not to eat the whole piece of cake at once but we had already purchased one in Amsterdam the previous day and got not even a tiny buzz from it... nothing at all. So we assumed that this was the same and ate the whole thing. Nothing weirder than waking up the next day fully high from the previous day. I am not kidding... just weird. We had to go to the Post Office and then later we went to the Escher Museum... talk about trippy.
But 3 days? Really... not likely. And not really gonna happen if you smoke it. Eating it prolongs the effects but smoking it does not.
ResearchMonkey
3/29/10, 01:26pm
Metabolites -- 3days.
trufax
Metabolites -- 3days.
trufax
Half-Life of THC...
http://www.ehow.com/about_5279857_marijuana-effect-metabolism.html
"THC remains in the plasma for at least three days with a half-life of 28 hours, increased to 57 hours for nonusers. "
It's going to depend ... I'll try to research more online. This was the first I found.
ResearchMonkey
3/29/10, 03:28pm
Knock yourself out Val. Immunoassay testing doesn't test for THC, it test for specific ~metabolites. Secondary, CGMS does the same.
http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/images/duration_chart_cannabis.gif
Cannabis Duration
Smoked
Total Duration
1 - 4 hrs
Onset
0 - 10 mins
Coming Up
5 - 10 mins
Plateau
15 - 30 mins
Coming Down
45 - 180 mins
After Effects
2 - 24 hrs
Hangover / Day After
0 - 24 hrs
Cannabis Duration
Oral
Total Duration
4 - 10 hrs
Onset
30 - 120 mins
Coming Up
30 - 60 mins
Plateau
2 - 5 hours
Coming Down
1 - 2 hours
After Effects
6 - 12 hrs
Hangover / Day After
0 - 24 hrs
http://www.erowid.org/plants/cannabis/cannabis_effects.shtml
So...you're fucked for around 2-5 hours...but mostly for only a few hours. Depending on the amount of alcohol you have (plus your weight, bmi, metabolism etc), and when you stop drinking, you can have similar duration of effect.
ResearchMonkey
3/29/10, 03:50pm
Whats great about your chart is that: while your high, you can test negative until you build up enough metabolites to meet the test threshold. In otherwords, a clean person can do bong-hits in the waiting room and test clean.
Keep smokin', ignorance is bliss.
Whats great about your chart is that: while your high, you can test negative until you build up enough metabolites to meet the test threshold. In otherwords, a clean person can do bong-hits in the waiting room and test clean.
Keep smokin', ignorance is bliss.
What "metabolites" are you referring to, then. I want to give your argument the benefit of the doubt but it's so vague. Sorry, not trying to start something here.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/metabolites
And ignorance is not bliss... it can be dangerous (on both sides). Just as there is no "reefer madness" and it has been proven that marijuana is not a gateway drug, it is also important to understand that marijuana, just like alcohol, is a mind altering substance. One should never get behind the wheel of a vehicle while under the influence of any substance that impairs the ability to react, etc. Responsible drinking, just like responsible smoking, should always take place.
Metabolism of alcohol...
http://alcoholism.about.com/cs/alerts/l/blnaa35.htm
What info I saw said that it can remain in the blood up to 30 days.
Also that it causes alcohol to remain longer too, there by possibly
causing higher intoxication in time/food/amount calculation.
ResearchMonkey
3/29/10, 05:08pm
ETOH is water soluble, delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol is fat soluble. Completely different in how your body interacts and process it.
Metabolism does not equate to metabolites. Metabolites are byproducts of how your organs are dealing with a specific chemistry.
Pot inferes with how the hippocampus process the recording of memory, specifically short term memory. Since learning is based on short term memory; Pot smokers, where stupid is made. Ignorance IS bliss.
@cato:
Correct, if you have organ problems, the processing can take longer depending on which organs/chemical combos your talking about. When you drink, ETOH permeates all body tissues, even your knee caps.
I'm trying to understand your use of the word "metabolites".
metabolite
1. A substance produced by metabolism.
2. A substance necessary for or taking part in a particular metabolic process. Examples of metabolites are glucose in the metabolism of sugars and starches, amino acids in the biosynthesis of proteins, and squalene in the biosynthesis of cholesterol.
Anyway... there is always going to be people who drink every day or drink to excess. They are alcoholics. They have a problem.
Marijuana is the same way. There is always going to be people who will use it every day.
In both situations it's the person who has the problem and that problem needs to be dealt with. Over use of any such substance is going to cause negative affects on the body.
I have to agree that there's no substitute for "personal responsibility"... on anything.
With out it, there can be no freedom...for long.
I have to agree that there's no substitute for "personal responsibility"... on anything.
With out it, there can be no freedom...for long.
Agreed! Wholeheartedly! Responsible drinking. Responsible smoking.
:headbng2:
BAD
http://www.topnews.in/files/smoking_4.jpg
GOOD
http://www.foxnews.com/images/340275/0_61_320x240_smoking_joint.jpg
ResearchMonkey
3/29/10, 09:20pm
I'm trying to understand your use of the word "metabolites". metabolite
A substance produced by metabolism.
A substance necessary for or taking part in a particular metabolic process.Well there it is there isn't it.
People will always abuse drugs; be it booze, dope or chocolate cake, often to the point of death. But who is silly ol' me to try and convince a doper who knows so much about the personal responsibilities of getting high.
Hey looky me, I'm typing words on the internet :headbng2:
BAD
http://www.topnews.in/files/smoking_4.jpg
GOOD
http://www.foxnews.com/images/340275/0_61_320x240_smoking_joint.jpg
Not necessarily, Gonz. I'm surprised you think so. I wouldn't have guessed you would have responded that way. :)
Tobacco use is usually not limited to once a week. Tobacco users often smoke more than once a day. This is not to say that some people who abuse marijuana are doing so more than once a day. G actually knows someone who used to smoke more than 5 times a day. That's someone with a substance abuse problem. Same as if they had 5 drinks of alcohol a day.
Then there are tobacco users that only smoke on occasion, socially. They tend not to be at the same risk of cancer as someone who smokes 2 packs a day.
Well there it is there isn't it.
People will always abuse drugs; be it booze, dope or chocolate cake, often to the point of death. But who is silly ol' me to try and convince a doper who knows so much about the personal responsibilities of getting high.
Hey looky me, I'm typing words on the internet :headbng2:
We're bringing obesity into the picture? Well, you have a point there. Food abuse is, in some ways, akin to substance abuse. So I will agree with you here. How many people die each year as a result of food abuse? Obesity is attributed to high blood pressure, diabetes and heart disease, to name a few of the problems. Some cancers are also linked to obesity as well. So I'll give you that one for sure.
But we're still talking about abuse of a substance, be it alcohol, food or marijuana. There's going to be people who will abuse any of these things. There are even sex addicts. But all of these things, in moderation, are not harmful. (Cuz I love sex! But hell, not all day every day! Shit!)I would even go as far as to say that tobacco (without the additives from the tobacco manufacturers) does not have to be harmful in moderation.
Oh, and BTW, you didn't really explain how you are using the word "metabolites". So I'm still confused with your post below.
ResearchMonkey
3/29/10, 11:21pm
No. Sugar and chocolate both have psychactive chemicals that can breach the BloodBrainBarrier with physiological effect. -- they are drugs.
As for the use of the word "metabolites", I'm using it as a noun but that not whats important here. The subject of metabolites is a bit complex in whole cloth. I don't really see any point in explaining the phys/pharm neuro/bio process and relationship to you. It wouldn't make any difference in your rationalized processing of the material.
Not necessarily, Gonz. I'm surprised you think so. I wouldn't have guessed you would have responded that way.
You couldn't see my tongue planted firmly in my cheek?
As far as addictions go...If you can cure yourself by changing your habits, it's not a disease.
You couldn't see my tongue planted firmly in my cheek?
Heh... I guess sarcasm doesn't come through so well in text. :laugh4:
As far as addictions go...If you can cure yourself by changing your habits, it's not a disease.
Some people can not cure themselves of their addiction. If they could there wouldn't be products to help like Nicorette and no need for cessation help from the medical profession.
I don't really equate habit or addiction with disease, though we know that an addiction to alcohol can result in various diseases (i.e., scoliosis of the liver).
No. Sugar and chocolate both have psychactive chemicals that can breach the BloodBrainBarrier with physiological effect. -- they are drugs.
As for the use of the word "metabolites", I'm using it as a noun but that not whats important here. The subject of metabolites is a bit complex in whole cloth. I don't really see any point in explaining the phys/pharm neuro/bio process and relationship to you. It wouldn't make any difference in your rationalized processing of the material.
Food by itself can have a psychological affect. I know an acquaintance (through someone else) who is very obese. I feel bad for the guy. He always seems to be exhausted. Movement is difficult for him. He looked into having surgery to reduce the size of his stomach but they told him he was a risk for surgery and they would not perform the surgery without him losing weight. That's how big he is. He confessed to my friend that food is the only thing that gives him pleasure. When food takes the place of all that is pleasurable then it is like a drug to the brain.
ResearchMonkey
3/30/10, 06:08pm
Food by itself can have a psychological affect. I know an acquaintance (through someone else) who is very obese. I feel bad for the guy. He always seems to be exhausted. Movement is difficult for him. He looked into having surgery to reduce the size of his stomach but they told him he was a risk for surgery and they would not perform the surgery without him losing weight. That's how big he is. He confessed to my friend that food is the only thing that gives him pleasure. When food takes the place of all that is pleasurable then it is like a drug to the brain.
I find your understanding comforting. I look forward to our new socialist health care program.
awww, everybody feel bad for the fat guy.
awww, everybody feel bad for the fat guy.
I do feel bad for him. It is sad. He finally wants to do something to stop his addiction and finds himself in a position where the only drastic thing he can think of to get this accomplished is beyond his reach. When you can't get any pleasure out of life except for food it's a problem and he recognizes that. I know what got him into the position he's in to begin with was his own fault. He recognizes it and wants to do something to reverse it, but that option is out of his hands.
...wants to do something to reverse it, but that option is out of his hands.
Put down the cake, drop the bottle, don't light that cigarette...it's never out of your hands. Tough doesn't mean impossible.
Put down the cake, drop the bottle, don't light that cigarette...it's never out of your hands. Tough doesn't mean impossible.
You're right and he's been trying. But you have no idea how big this guy has gotten. I think he needs help.
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